The following is an automatic transcription of the “Campus Health Read Fall 2024: Anxious Generation”
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USC: all right. Hello, everybody. Good afternoon. Welcome. Thank you all for coming. What a nice turnout! And we have a crowd on zoom as well.
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USC: I’m David Mazurian. I’m going to be your moderator today before we get started. I did want to tell a couple of thank yous and introductions. We want to thank, of course, our sponsors, the Usc. Libraries, for everything they’ve done, including providing us with this room, Usc. Annenberg home to many of us who are participating today.
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USC: Dean Bay, good to see you
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USC: right on cue. Right?
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USC: Also our friends from student health.
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USC: especially Minnie ho! And Teresa Lara for joining us, for helping us put this event together.
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USC: and we want to thank our folks from Usc. Events and also from Usc. Price, for providing us with our technical help, without which we could not do our event today.
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USC: And we would like to acknowledge this event. Does land during Rosh Hashanah.
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USC: So we say, Shana Tovah
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USC: to all of those who are celebrating this event and those of us who are watching on the recording because you’re celebrating the holiday instead.
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USC: I told you I’m David. I’m the managing editor of the Usc. News website at University Communications. I also teach at Annenberg.
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USC: and I’ve been there for quite a long time. I saw in Kelly’s bio. You’ve been here 19 years. I’ve actually been here a little longer than that, and joining us is Dr. Kelly. Greco Kelly is a clinical associate professor of psychiatry and Behavioral sciences
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USC: with the Keck School of Medicine she teaches at Usc. Resear. She is the embedded clinician at Annenberg.
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USC: and also works in counseling and mental health services at the Engelmann Student Health Center.
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USC: And she’s only one person doing all of that. How do you do that?
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USC: Also up here with us is
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USC: Melanie Robichaud.
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USC: who is Annenberg student, and she’s president of the student group called The happy hour which is dedicated to
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USC: destigmatizing the topic of mental health in a casual and welcoming environment.
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USC: And also we have 2 other Usc Annenberg students, who will be joining us later on in the program we have Daniela Lake and Brianna Rue, who this summer did some research on this very topic, and they’re going to share with us the research they found, and also some other observations.
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USC: We do have a nice agenda for us. We’re going to start with a general overview of the topic. We’ll have Kelly give us her perspective as a clinician and also a parent of teenagers.
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USC: Our students will give us their input, and then we’ll have time for some questions and answers at the end. You all have little cards. If you have any questions, please fill out the cards, and the folks will collect those and also on Zoom. If you have questions just put them in the chat, and our monitor will get those questions, and we’ll take care of those.
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USC: So I want to start with just discussing a little bit about this book, the anxious generation. When Minnie 1st mentioned this topic. Minnie ho! At student health mentioned this to me. It really just hit home, because, you know, I’m an adjunct at Annenberg, so I’m not there full time, but I still see our students often enough, and in the 20 plus years that I’ve been teaching.
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USC: mental health has always been a concern of ours. But we’ve really seen things change. And we’ve seen levels of stress increase and change every semester that I teach. I am always giving our resource list to our students, and I know that I’ve always had one or 2 or more of them who are taking advantage of those resources. And so when I started to read this book. The whole premise of it is just so interesting that
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USC: that young people are now rewired.
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USC: They’re not. They’re not growing up the way they used to, they
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USC: old person speaking here I looked up. And, by the way, the author of the book, Dr. Jonathan Haidt, is about the same age as me. So he remembers, you know, back when we were young, our parents said, You’re on your phone too much, or you’re you’re watching TV too much.
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USC: And now it’s you’re wired too much. But we were not on watching TV 24, 7. We weren’t on our phones. 24, 7.
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USC: So I think it’s interesting.
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USC: in the book. I know many of you have read it. Many of you are probably part way through it. Many of you will read it. After this it is available free through the libraries. By the way, he identified 4 foundational harms that threaten the mental health of kids.
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USC: social deprivation, and he notes that since 2010 people are young, people are spending
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USC: 50% less time with others than they used to. So just think about that. That’s I mean half
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USC: sleep, deprivation. We’re going to talk a little bit about the concept of sleep hygiene later, and I have
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USC: a bad habit that I will confess it’ll make you all laugh. Attention, fragmentation. You know, we can’t focus anymore because we’re just always plugged in. We give you 30 seconds and we give you 30 seconds and wait for our phone to beep
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USC: and then addiction, and that kids are really using their phones like, I like this phrase, a dopamine slot machine
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USC: and don’t realize they’re doing it. And when I say kids, it’s not fair to say kids because we’re talking about young adults, older adults, people of all ages, but especially the group that has grown up with these devices.
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USC: And in the scene in the book he also provides 4
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USC: foundational reforms that he suggests could help us overcome these issues. Because to me, what’s interesting is we have 2 issues here. One is, how do we help the young adults who grew up with these devices
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USC: and didn’t realize that they were basically part of a social experiment.
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USC: And then how do we help
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USC: the next group of people who will be growing up with the devices. But now we’re aware that there’s challenges, and those are 2 different sets, because one is, how do we guide people into it. Another is, how do we almost help people recover
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USC: and then deal with them through our lives? Because it’s
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USC: in some ways it’s like an eating disorder. You can’t just stop eating, you know, we need to be plugged in. You can’t get on a plane. You can’t get on campus.
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USC: I mean, you need to. You need to use your device. But how can we do it healthfully and and protect our own mental health?
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USC: And some of his suggestions are no smartphones at all before high school.
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USC: which
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USC: I’d like to hear what the parents in the crowd would think about, that
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USC: the idea of no social media before age 16,
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USC: phone free schools, not just during class, but lock them away altogether. And this is very timely, you know. Just last week in California. The Governor signed the law that will require all schools to set policies that limit or prohibit the use of smartphones in classes.
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USC: but at the same time. Just today the Chancellor of the public school district in the city of New York came out against such a policy.
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USC: And there’s there’s some discussion over whether that might have been under just under pressure.
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USC: But it’s definitely an issue that that there’s not universal agreement about. But I saw I saw a poll. Today, 60% of parents across both parties
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USC: support limiting the use limiting access to smartphones while their students are in school.
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USC: which I thought was really interesting.
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USC: and then far more unsupervised play and childhood independence.
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USC: Kelly, you and I talked about this a little bit before the program today.
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USC: So just some really interesting.
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USC: There’s so many more questions than answers.
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USC: But I’m not the expert, and Kelly is the expert. So
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USC: why don’t we get Kelly’s perspective? And this is a really interesting perspective, I think, because you know, as we said, you’re a psychologist and psychiatrist and a mom of teenagers. Yeah. So you’ve seen this from from all sides. Yes, so, psychologist, parent and professor.
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USC: I think in terms of you know, going on what you just said, David, that we need to kind of shift back what the author states is more unsupervised play, but more supervised on in the virtual world.
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USC: So everything kind of needs to shift a little bit and like he talked about. And it’s very interesting in terms of you know, and I read about Newsom’s bill, and where we’re headed to in our State and have 2 teenagers myself. And sometimes I’m like, how are they able to text me at 1015 in the morning? Right? And they’re able to. And so
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USC: really kind of looking at, where is this shift? Because, like the author says, we need to be collective. And this is what we see as many of us in the field that we’re in a mental health crisis, right? We have high, high numbers of depression, anxiety, especially postpartum.
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USC: especially adolescents and young adults. We’ve already had enough research. That shows the correlation and association with the number of hours that I’m on. The phone can correlate to my anxiety, depression, sense of self, body, image, and so forth. So I think we need to just kind of look at, and I think you said it very well, I can’t get off my phone right? So I even look at my own kids. And they have all their textbooks on an ipad. So they have to be on electronics, but in terms of
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USC: like what the author said of how am I using it? When am I using it? How often? And the content in terms of what apps that I’m exposed to, or relating to, and so forth.
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USC: But I think the thing, too, with all of that is, and I come from a place of a lot of positive psychology and strength based is that when we hear the word anxiety, we think that that’s a bad thing, and we really need to look at that as anxiety is part of life. Life is stressful, life is full of suffering, but it’s how we recover and bounce back.
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USC: And so we see in terms of that. That is what we want to look at. So the anxious generation is not a bad thing, because we all get anxious, including myself. But it’s how we recover and what we do with anxiety. So that’s where I think we really need to hone in is, how do we cope? And how do we make different decisions
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USC: politically and in terms of structurally, with the school system as well as in my own house as well as with myself. Now, when we look at the Surgeon General and American Psychological Association that has some guidelines.
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USC: and I always talk about this in my parent talks especially being a parent myself is when people say, How do I help my child? How do I help them be more resilient. It starts with us, and when you look at those guidelines, it talks about
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USC: what, how am I using it? And am I abiding by what I set in terms of guidelines. And am I being a role model? So I think whether we’re a professor, a parent, a friend, that role modeling is crucial, but that’s where it goes back to. It’s a collective approach that he’s advising. And so you bring up that good point about what’s happening in California and New York, or what may be happening at my best friend’s house, and what’s at my house? And there’s that challenge.
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USC: And how do I work with that?
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USC: I like that you picked up on on the point that we were
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USC: overprotecting our children in the real world, right and underprotecting them in the cyber world, and I think
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USC: we can excuse ourselves because we didn’t realize the protection we needed to be giving in the cyber world. Yes, but I thought you made an interesting point about how we’re learning along the way. Do you want to share what you were telling me earlier about? Yeah. So you know, having 2 Gen. Zs reading the book, it made me recognize and reflect as a parent some things that I did
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USC: and some things that I just naturally did, because everyone was doing it, or the other thing that I think we don’t want to minimize is, Apa came out with a survey, saying that parenting is causing extreme stress. And what are we doing about it to help parents? And so sometimes life can be so stressful that we may take the easy route, or may overthink some things.
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USC: And so what I had brought up was that the structured play play dates, we structure who our kids are going to see.
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USC: and from my experience it was a lot from preschool till about 4th or 5th grade, and then middle school, I was told, no, mom, it’s not play dates. It’s hangouts, and you know, of course I stepped away, but I still have another ear out of who are they hanging with? Because what we see. And this comes out of the research part of the book
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USC: is it’s the quality of relationships, not the quantity. So we do also have to redefine, not just anxiety, but relationships. It’s not the number of people I know on Tiktok or Instagram or Facebook or Snapchat. Whoever I’m snapping.
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USC: It is the quality of relationships. Do I have one or 2 people that I can confide in that? Accept me unconditionally. This is where we need to start and what we need to help reframe. Because I think and this is just my own personal issue. The social media push of having hundreds and thousands of views can get you some things. But it’s not about getting quality relationships. Yeah.
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USC: let’s talk about
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USC: the idea that not all anxiety is bad. It reminds me. I remember I read a book several years ago about good and bad stress, and we think of stress as being a bad thing. But it helps you learn. It helps you cope. It helps you, you know, gain resiliency. You know, kids learn young people adolescents learn from the mistakes they make.
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USC: How do you help? How do you help them through?
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USC: How do you help the anxiety of those years when you throw in the social media the smartphone? And how do you tell
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USC: when is anxiety? Okay? And when is it not? Yeah. It’s a great question, I think, in terms of when you look at what is part of life
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USC: in terms of a disappointment, a loss for so for college students, it’s maybe not getting this grade that I wanted, or an internship, or this opportunity.
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USC: or something happens in a relationship of that. That’s part of life, and that’s not a reflection about who I am. So how am I going to have the grit and persevere versus something’s wrong with me, so it’s reframing that anxiety is part of life. But when it interferes with our day-to-day functions, sleep eating, I can’t get to class.
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USC: I can’t stop crying, or my heart doesn’t stop racing more often than not. Then we need to look at getting professional help and looking at. Maybe I need to shift to do things differently to manage it. So I always talk about. We have to take fix out of our vocabulary.
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USC: and it’s about managing. We can’t fix our feelings. We’re human beings, but we need to manage it. So just that slight language and perspective helps us. So it’s not like you said getting rid of the phones because we can’t. It’s how do I sleep differently with the phone? And I’ve had these conversations.
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USC: Are you putting it across the room rather than right next to you? Is it the 1st thing you check in the morning, or are you having a morning routine. That’s more about meditation and looking at my schedule and doing something that’s more relaxing. So it’s just making different decisions that also feeds into that. But it’s reframing and looking at it as part of life, and that it’s not a bad thing. So
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USC: this is a good time for me to confess my bad, my terrible habit so wordle the puzzle we’re all addicted to right. They release a new one at midnight, right? So if I wake up and it’s after midnight. I immediately reach to my phone, turn my phone on, solve the problem, and then go back to sleep. The good thing about that is, at least it’s done, and I can go back to sleep. But the bad thing is, my whole sleep is now. It’s like 1145, and I’m like. Should I try to sleep, or should I just wait 15 more minutes until the new puzzle’s there, right right. But think about that. They released it at midnight.
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USC: So you know, and in terms of. And again, it’s that excitement, but again making different decisions about. And I know there’s a lot of things released at midnight. That’s a whole nother discussion. But that does interfere with our sleep. And we need to make different decisions, even though that’s available and going to happen. How do you help people identify when the habit is bad? Because it seems like it’s fun.
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USC: I mean, we all thought it was fun when we 1st got our smartphones. We 1st got on social media. In fact, I 1st got on Facebook, because students in my own class said to me, there’s this new thing called Facebook. You need to be on there. And I was like, Oh, it was really fun until it stopped being fun. And then I kind of dug myself out of it. But how do you? How do you identify that? And then how do you have other people, especially if the people you’re dealing with are, you know, teenagers, or even younger.
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USC: I think, in terms of it’s again how you use it. So I always talk about what is your relationship with social media and technology. And some people have heard me say this, I say, if your sense of self or sense of self-esteem is wrapped up and related to how many likes I get or how many views I get.
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USC: Then we’ve got a problem right? So my identity and my sense of self needs to be internal needs to be about my community, my culture, my values, my goals. It’s not about what’s seen in technology, or what other people are saying or doing so when you’re grounded in what I know what’s best for me.
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USC: and that social comparison is not putting myself down and idolizing and putting the others up that I’m viewing on social media. And more of like, okay, this is someone that I want to emulate. They inspire me. What can I learn from them. That’s healthy social comparison, because it goes back to like what we said. Originally we all compare ourselves socially as human beings. It’s part of life. But again, how we do it dictates whether or not it can be
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USC: negative, destructive, or even part of bringing myself down in my sense of self
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USC: makes a lot of sense
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USC: just real quickly when someone comes to you, especially if you’re embedded over there, which I think is we could talk about that for hours
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USC: do people come to you and say, I have a problem with social media? Or do people come to you and say, I have a problem. And then, as you talk through with them, you realize it’s it’s driven by social media.
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USC: I think it’s both. When I think of being a parent professor and psychologist, it’s both.
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USC: And so I again I let them take the lead, which again also comes out of some of the guidelines that we’re seeing of that. You know. Parents or those of us that are authority. Figures like professors need to, you know. Talk about it in a way of just not shutting it down, that it’s a negative thing, right?
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USC: Because you’re going to shut down the conversation with the person, but in terms of talking about what are the consequences. So when you look at your phone 1st thing in the morning, or when you’re, you know, doom scrolling, how does that make you feel so they answer it. And then I just kind of connected of like, hmm, what could we do? Differently?
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USC: So again, it’s about the consequences and different behaviors, because we know, especially as parents. You can tell your kid till you’re blue in the face.
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USC: Get off your phone. You’re on it too long. It doesn’t work. But when my kids have been off it and have actually seen the effect that has had on them psychologically, there’s a shift so that goes for any one of us.
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USC: Great. This is a good time to bring Melanie in. What are your thoughts? Because, you know you, you’ve helped organize this group at Annenberg. That helps. You know.
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USC: the happy hour that helps people be positive in a positive environment which means you’ve identified this as a problem through your own eyes. What are your thoughts?
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USC: Yeah, I think, growing up in the digital age and having social media at a very young age, just because it’s that thing like
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USC: everyone’s on it, and it doesn’t seem to be doing anything horrible yet. I mean, yeah, you get onto it. I got on Instagram and Snapchat in 6th grade, I think, which is obviously a very
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USC: transformative time in one’s life, and I think
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USC: you don’t really notice how comparative it is until it’s too late. So
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USC: you’re thinking this person gets this many likes, and this person gets this many comments and followers and all that stuff.
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USC: and you notice it. But you don’t really feel the need to change it, because it’s hard to really recognize, I guess.
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USC: And yeah, I’ve seen
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USC: it in myself. Even I can recognize it, but it’s hard to change.
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USC: and I think you know, having it as such an integral part of our society and culture. It’s hard to
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USC: kind of shake that attitude of comparison.
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USC: and I think you know, obviously having conversations like these and having the happy hour where we’re trying to build a community of positivity, and recognizing these challenges and then trying to move it through it together, is really helpful.
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USC: I was going to say, tell us more about the happy hour. What? What? Exactly do you 1st of all, what inspired you
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USC: to make that happen? And then what? Exactly do you do?
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USC: So I’m taking on this role right now, 1st year. But I was really interested in the concept of talking about mental health in a very casual setting, because I think
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USC: approaching. It can be very daunting for many, and while there’s options like therapy and
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USC: medicine and everything, I think you know, it’s it’s scary to go one on one with a therapist and kind of address these problems head head on. And I think having a community of fellow students and peers is really helpful because it makes you feel less alone, especially in such a stressful time. That is college.
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USC: because you’re not only entering this new academic phase, but it’s also a complete social shift, especially when you’re living on campus. You’re living with a roommate, maybe for the 1st time.
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USC: I think it’s important to have open and honest discussions about that.
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USC: you know, on the 1st day of class, when I go through the syllabus and we get to the resource page, everybody tunes it out because they’ve already heard this in all of the other classes, and I’m always trying to say, No, no, pay attention. There’s a reason we have all these resources for you, and perhaps on the 1st day of the semester, you don’t realize you’re going to need them, but it’s important that they’re there and, like you said, there’s been so many changes in your life.
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USC: That’s your 1st year, but even your second and 3rd and 4th years, you’re still, you know there’s a whole different set of stresses you’re having to deal with and then thrown in the fact that
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USC: people of your age were guinea pigs in an experiment that none of us thought you were going to be part of, and that’s certainly
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USC: a scary place to be.
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USC: Can I add one thing, please. When Melanie was talking, I was thinking about, too, that the Cdc talks about a protective factor is school connectedness.
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USC: And so this organization helps with that. It creates a sense of belonging shared values community on a very important issue. So I think again, this is just one of many that really is a protective factor.
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USC: What do you do with people’s phones?
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USC: Well, we’re just starting out this this year. This semester with, you know, new set of
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USC: I don’t know structure. But I think
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USC: we had our 1st meeting on Tuesday. Yeah. And it was very no phone zone. Nothing was really, you know, don’t bring out your phone. But it was, I think.
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USC: having an open community. It kind of makes you forget about your phone. You’re not really thinking what’s going on on Instagram. What’s going on on, Tiktok. It’s because you’re actually communicating with people in person. And I think that that’s such an attractive part of college is you get to
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USC: meet new people, and you get to communicate. And
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USC: I don’t know, form really special bonds and relationships. So I think that kind of helps distract from
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USC: the chaos of a phone.
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USC: I love that especially because
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USC: if you’re plugged into your phone, think of all the things you’re missing out on
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USC: during your college years. No, no, no, no, don’t miss out on this.
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USC: That’s very cool.
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USC: We wanted to talk a little bit about the digital realm in the workplace, and this is something that really hits home for me, and I think
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USC: our Annenberg students will certainly relate to this. You know I was a professional journalist before I came to Usc. Where I, where our vice President regularly points out to me that I’m not a real journalist anymore, because I run the Usc website. But
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USC: that made me laugh.
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USC: but
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USC: professional journalists feel the need to be plugged in all the time, and that’s terribly unhealthy. When I was a reporter a thousand years ago. We didn’t have cell phones, and so I had to be at home.
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USC: If I went on an assignment they would give me a beeper, a pager. I had to be reached by the office. Willa’s nodding. You remember these days? I remember pagers? Yes, oh, yeah, and and they were terrible, and I would have been so envious of having a device where I could be plugged in all the time. But also it’s terrible. So what do you do now in your job? Because
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USC: when you’re starting out in your career, you can’t tell your boss I’m turning my phone off at 5 PM.
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USC: You know, there, there are some countries where you they legally cannot contact you anymore during the times you’re not working.
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USC: But for us, when you guys start your careers, you’re going to tell me that I can’t call you after 5 o’clock. Well, you know what that means to your career. I promote you and not you.
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USC: How do?
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USC: How do you go through that? And it’s not just people beginning their career.
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USC: There are jobs where we are expected to be on call all the time.
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USC: How do you
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USC: make yourself reachable
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USC: and protect your own mental health? Any ideas from?
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USC: Yeah, Holly, what do you think? The thing that comes to me is we need to have an identity or values outside of our career.
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USC: something that gives us joy, something that we’re passionate about, because we know when we looked at the research with well-being, it’s about meaning and purpose and increasing those joyful moments. So
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USC: taking something outside of that identity. Whatever your profession is. So I am having those conversations of like, let’s unplug. Let’s not check the news when I don’t have to report on the news.
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USC: So that’s really, really important. And again, it goes back to like what you and I said in the very beginning, it’s making those decisions that are proactive and intentional, because we can just be scrolling. And we have free time. And we don’t really know what we’re doing. So it has to be something very intentional.
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USC: Yeah. As I was thinking about this, I came to 1 1 thought, which is a bad boss, is a bad boss
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USC: and
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USC: you can’t control what your bad boss does. But you can control your circumstance. That’s right. And I think your mental health is probably more important than just about any career. That doesn’t mean you should
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USC: not get a career and treat it badly. But if you have a boss whose expectations are are
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USC: are so much that you can’t
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USC: take care of yourself, and that might not be the right place, for you. Don’t quit tomorrow. Get a new job first, st but watch out for your own self. Yeah, I always talk about you focus on what you can control and let go of what you can’t. So focus on you and what you can control. Yeah.
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USC: So Danielle and Brianna, why don’t we bring you guys up now?
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USC: full disclosure?
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USC: Brianna and and Danielle are going to talk to us about some work they did this summer in a class that I was their teacher for.
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USC: and a couple things that were really interesting is that this was the topic they chose to to research and do a piece. For in our data, our data journalism class.
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USC: But also it was interesting to me that they had. They could have chose anything to write about from fashion to sports, to entertainment, to Usc issues, to immigration. And they chose literally this issue of cell phone use among young people. And I thought it was really interesting that 2 young adults would would identify this just as you have, Melanie, that this is an issue of such importance. But also they came up with, their research was really amazing. They came up with some wonderful numbers which which totally reflect the kind of things you see in the book.
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USC: And also they talked to some really interesting sources that they’re going to share with us as well, so
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USC: hi everyone! My name’s Daniela and Brianna, and, as David said, we worked on a project this summer about youth, mental health, and social media in light of La Usd banning cell phones, and also the Surgeon General’s advisory on youth, Mental health, and social media. So
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USC: 1st we looked at some data from Boston Children’s Hospital’s digital wellness lab, yeah. And in this data we can see that a majority of the adolescents who were surveyed. They agree that they are a little bit too addicted to social media, and they see that they are on their screens too much, and that they are not sleeping well.
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USC: But in the survey. It also discussed how a lot of these students, I mean, adolescents, are in families who set regulations on how much they are going to use their phones, and how much screen time they get, and all these things, and they agreed that it was helpful for them in their experiences.
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USC: I also saw that a lot of them use social media to connect with, keep in contact with people and connect with people and find groups that they are comfortable in groups for them. So it showed that there are cons to having screens. But there are also pros in which you can find people that you can connect with very well
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USC: more than you would in person per se. Or, if you have like social anxiety.
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USC: you can meet people online. It might be better for some. So it was just a little bit of both in this survey.
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USC: And so we also talked with teachers in Los Angeles who teach high school and middle school students about what they’ve observed in their students. And so one teacher, who’s been a teacher for 28 years. She was talking to me about how she noticed anxiety in this generation that she didn’t really notice before.
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USC: And she was talking about how specifically, after the pandemic, too, she just felt that our generation is dealing with things that no generation before us, you know, has had to deal with. And it’s something she’s definitely noticed, a change in behavior, and just how the students seem to feel about their lives.
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USC: And then also, she and other teachers notice a lot less in-person interaction. You know, they talked about quieter hallways. The cafeteria is quieter. They’ll see students in the hallway watching a show on Netflix instead of talking to each other. Another teacher he mentioned that there’s less promposals. And you know those typical interactions before class and during class breaks, it just seems quieter
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USC: and then also positive social comparison that was mentioned earlier. So one of the teachers, a middle school teacher, she actually said that her students said they enjoyed seeing where
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USC: their friends went to vacation because it helped them see that part of the world through their friend’s eyes, and she gave the example of one of her students, went to Iceland for a family vacation, and their friends said they love seeing Iceland and getting to learn about Iceland in that way. So I thought that that was a really nice example to hear.
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USC: And then also we did speak to parents as well. We talked to a parent who has a daughter in elementary middle school and high school, so she has one in each, and she was just saying how sometimes it can be a struggle, you know, with family time, not just the girls putting their phones down, but the entire family putting their phones down, because, you know, it’s not just our generation that’s affected, but all of us sometimes feel that addiction to our phones, even our parents.
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USC: and then also with cyberbullying. This is something that she brought up, and all of the teachers we spoke to mentioned issues with bullying and harassment online, and she was talking about how her middle School age daughter had a bullying situation that was going on in person, and she, as a mom, was concerned that it would move online, and that that could be worse, because then they could, you know, reach her daughter at any point in the day.
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USC: and we also spoke to Maggie Cooper, who is a professional. She’s part of a research team who’s researching social media in relation to adolescent mental health.
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USC: and she kind of saw both sides of the situation. That yes, there are a lot of cons to having social media in on our hand at all time. But
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USC: there’s also that idea that we, the anxious generation, are the experts of how to manage this.
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USC: Our phones on social media and the way we access technology at all times. So she advised, like if and the partners that she works with are adolescents as well. So she works with them closely, and they say that if they feel that they are being anxious, they’ll just put their phones on. Do not disturb, and utilizing the features that many phones do have like focus mode. If.
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USC: like finals are coming up, or you need to study just putting that phone on silent and do not disturb and focus mode helps a lot of people. Or if you’re becoming overwhelmed with finals, or you want to step away from social media for a while a lot of people just
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USC: put their social medias on
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USC: temporarily deactivate them. And that’s what a lot of people do. So she said that it’s it’s our jobs as the experts to learn how to create a boundary between us and technology.
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USC: And yeah, we also wanted to share some of the boundaries that like we’ve created for ourselves. One thing that I’ve done since High School is I stopped watching people’s Instagram stories so literally for the past like years. I haven’t watched people’s Instagram stories I enjoy posting on mine myself, because I treat it as like a digital scrapbook. But yeah, and I feel like that’s helped me not compare myself to other people, because I’m not seeing like.
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USC: oh, this person, you know, did this cool thing, or this person did this, and instead, for my close friends. I have post notifications, so when they post I’ll see it. But I’m not ever scrolling through my feed and just seeing everyone’s posts, and I feel like that’s something that’s helped me maintain, you know, a good mental health. I do utilize focus mode a lot. And also I set my on iphone. You can set a timer to where your phone goes to sleep.
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USC: I have mine for like 9, 30, and everyone gets mad because they can’t reach me past 9, 30,
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USC: and they’re like, why can’t? Why does it go to voicemail? And it’s just it’s just asleep. My phone’s asleep, so that one I know when it’s time for me to go to sleep.
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USC: Yeah, well, thank you so much.
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USC: So many good things there. And I just want to point out. It’s not like these 2 are old fashioned and have no interest in social media. I mean, they wouldn’t be master’s students at Annenberg if they weren’t, and Daniela is an accomplished podcaster. How long have you had your podcast since I was 15? I’m 20,
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USC: right? So it’s not like these are the 2 kids that don’t like social like don’t like
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USC: modern technology. I want to stray just a little bit real quick. What made you guys choose this for the project for our class.
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USC: Well, I’ve always had an interest in mental health and psychology, and you know, since a young age like I said in high school, I kind of set those boundaries, and I felt like it was really good for me. So I’ve just always been drawn to conversations around mental health. And then I heard that the Surgeon General had put out this advisory specifically about youth, mental health, you know, citing all these experts who’ve seen these issues. So
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USC: yeah, Brianna, any thoughts? Yeah. So also, like what Daniela said it was just. We had a variety of topics to choose from. And just this one hit more closer to home, because it’s something we’re familiar with. We use everyday technology. And you want to know, like.
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USC: what is being affected, how are we being affected, and we kind of found out
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USC: 8.
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USC: Yeah, I love. I love the timeliness of it, because, you know, we were discussing that. I think when the Surgeon General’s report had just come out
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USC: up.
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USC: You talked a lot about self-awareness, and that
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USC: almost is an overriding theme. Here, Melanie. Any thoughts about
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USC: you know that the experts that told told these guys
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USC: that we are the experts ourselves.
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USC: Yeah, I think there’s some good and some bad to that, because obviously we’ve grown up with this, you know new technology in our hands.
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USC: and while we understand it probably best out of any other generation, I also think that makes it even more addicting.
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USC: because you just can’t really get off of it. It’s what you’re used to, and I think that makes setting those boundaries even more difficult.
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USC: But I think it’s important to recognize it, even though it can be hard to
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USC: stop the doom scroll.
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USC: I mean, it’s it’s a funny term, but it’s so true.
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USC: It’s hard to get out of that loop and that rabbit hole, especially when there’s
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USC: constant news. It’s just
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USC: we’re always inundated with chaos and news and fun and exciting stuff. But yeah, I think it’s important to be self-aware about it and kind of recognize that we’re the experts. But we also have this responsibility to
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USC: take care of ourselves.
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USC: Yep.
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USC: Kelly, you made the comment about
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USC: not checking the news when you don’t have to report on it. I often joke that I’m like the only journalism, professor that tries to avoid the news.
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USC: which is a terrible place to be, because obviously I need to be informed. But I don’t want to be over informed. If that’s even a possibility. You guys hit on something, though, that, I think, is really interesting. We focused on, and the book focuses a lot about the negatives of our smartphones and social media. But are there good things?
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USC: And I loved when you found the students who liked the travel pictures. And I think in class, you had said that the teacher was actually concerned, that the students were going to be jealous of their of their their classmates, but instead, they learned from it.
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USC: Can you think of any other? Are there other good things that come of this. Well, I think that’s what I was saying earlier. It’s just reframing. It’s a different perspective of about seeing, was it Iceland that they went to? It was more about learning about it and sharing about it versus they’re in Iceland, and I’m not right. So it’s it’s more in terms of how you perceive it and the meaning behind it.
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USC: So that’s what we have to shift. So if we have a negative reaction in terms of irritability or jealousy, or just, you know, poor mental health. I think we have to look at what is the meaning, and how am I thinking about this? And how am I using it.
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USC: I found a couple years ago.
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USC: Instagram was
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USC: was the one that I found myself getting angry like I would look at it, and it was I don’t know why I was getting angry. It wasn’t like I wanted to be Kim Kardashian, but but
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USC: I would leave it, not feeling better than I started, and that got me. Instagram was the one that I broke myself away from, too. Right? And again, we got to normalize that self-compassion like it’s okay, because we’re a human being. So, even though you feel that you’re going to as a human being. But then, what am I going to do about it? And if I continue to use more, and you know the hours that I’m on it increase, then that’s where we’re maybe getting into trouble.
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USC: Yeah, we have some other topics. We wanted to talk about social comparison we’re talking about here, but also body imaging. Yeah, eating playtime.
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USC: You have some thoughts on those. Yeah. I pulled up the. I’m really glad you brought up the Surgeon General’s advisory guidelines because they’re excellent and definitely something to read, and it talked about which to me this was really startling, that 46% of teens from 13 to 17 said that in terms of the impact on body image, it made it worse by viewing where versus 14% said they feel better. So it’s like, how can we flip that again?
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USC: Kind of looking at it through more of a positive psychology of like, how can we get it? 46% makes me feel better, right than worse. So again, I think it’s in terms of that comparison, and how we are comparing, and the hours and the usage. But then it comes back to that sense of self and identity, of how do. I feel good about myself, and that’s where we got to start as well, because if I’m trying to feel good about what I am looking at, and that’s feeding my self-esteem. Then that may be problematic.
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USC: And I think it’s important to note, and the book makes a good point of this. This affects men and women, boys and girls. Social media tends to affect women more and young women more. But the percentages of
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USC: increases in
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USC: bad things are the same on both, you know. Boys, boys may have started here, but they’ve doubled here. Girls started here, and they’ve doubled to here. It also is not just an American phenomenon. This is anywhere that social media and smartphones exist which is basically almost everywhere. Now.
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USC: even in places where economically, you might not think smartphones are pervasive they are because you need them, no matter where you are. So it’s an issue that really is affecting nearly everyone.
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USC: We are about our Q. And a time so
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USC: great. Teresa, thank you.
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USC: Okay.
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USC: we’ll start with our
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USC: first.st Oh, dear.
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USC: This is written really small. How effective of a solution
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USC: would this be
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USC: no phones in the room.
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USC: How how effective
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USC: of a solution is no phones in the room
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USC: you mean as of right now or just in general, I think, in general, and then specifically in classrooms. Yeah, I think you know, I go to the place, and I know when Melanie was talking I was thinking about this in terms of you know, coming together as a group with no phones is your present, your present and you’re focused. So it goes back to. I’m in the here and now, which is what increases positive mental health. So it’s being more in the present moment and not distracted. And I’m not multitasking so.
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USC: and then the other question, by the way, I realized, if I hold it this way in the light, it’s better. And yes, I’m going to make an eye appointment. Okay? How can we respond to laptops in the classroom, especially in elementary schools?
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USC: Because we’re, you know, we’re telling you we don’t want you to be on electronic devices. Now sit in front of electronic device.
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USC: Well, and I know I can speak with being a parent, that there are. And I know a lot of people know. This is that there’s lots of parental controls on those laptops and ipads that the schools give. So there’s a lot of restrictions and a lot of things that they can’t do, which is what the author of the book talked about, of, that we need to have stricter, you know, restrictions on where they can and can’t go.
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USC: So I know that that helps a lot. But then they’re on their laptops or on their ipads at school, and then they’re on their phones at home. So that’s where I think we have to come back to that collective approach that the author talks about is, how can we across the board make different decisions where there is a collective time and group where we’re staying off of it?
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USC: And one thing I thought was really interesting in the book’s numbers is, if you look at the speed with which smartphones became pervasive, the timetable was smaller than any other technology in history, and the writer, as you may have noticed in the book he talks about the adoption of color. TV took a period of No. 8 or 10 years the adoption of
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USC: Internet Wi-fi access took 3 or 4 years. The adoption of smartphones was almost within one year, where it literally went from no one had one to. Everyone had one.
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USC: And it’s just
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USC: it is everywhere.
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USC: has. This is a question off of Zoom.
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USC: has helicopter parenting protected kids from any real dangers. That’s a good question, and
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USC: are free range children also a risk. I love that phrase.
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USC: Well, I think if we look at what the author speaks about is that they need an amount of risk they need, just like we need an amount of stress and anxiety to motivate us, to give us meaning that we need some risk to learn about the consequences. So, and that’s what he said and what we all talk about. So I think it depends on
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USC: what the play is right. If they’re playing with something that’s dangerous. That’s a whole nother story. But I think in terms of
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USC: we have become so much on the other side of having restrictions and guidelines for things that are on the playground. Or this is how you play, or just like how I shared of like structured play dates. I’m not saying they’re bad. But after reading the book kind of made me think about the impact of that, and rather than just letting them go out and make their own decisions, because that’s how they learn at the end of the day.
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USC: Well, and that’s always the question for parents. I have a dog. I don’t have a child, but and my dog doesn’t have a smartphone, but no one teaches you how to be a parent. So you have to figure out on your own. Well, now, all of a sudden, there’s this whole, you know.
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USC: It’s exponentially harder than ever was. Yeah, you know, you know that if your kid runs, you know, runs down the street and falls, there might break their arm. Okay.
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USC: you don’t want that to happen. They’ll learn from it. They’ll run more carefully.
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USC: How do you learn how to help them navigate
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USC: the electronic world?
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USC: Well, I think 1st off. You have to manage your own anxiety right? Because the author, one of actually my favorite quotes from the book was in terms of over parenting, creates anxiety
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USC: and creates a lot of issues down the road. So again, it goes back to like what I said earlier of it starts with us as the caregiver as a parent or as a professor, that we have to really manage our own anxiety. And so it’s about managing my own anxiety
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USC: that will not over spill onto them. But then it’s also creating boundaries and restrictions. Right? So you had talked about how it’s hard to get off the phone. And I think. The other thing that we don’t want to dismiss or minimize is that our brains don’t stop developing until age 25.
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USC: And the area in the brain that’s still growing till age 25 is, you know, executive functioning, the prefrontal cortex. So that’s about decision making and planning and prioritizing and consequences. So here we are giving them something to do where they’re not even fully developed to make those decisions and exposed to adult things. So I think in terms of
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USC: it goes back to like what the book said is having parental controls and guidelines, with something as well as managing our own anxiety.
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USC: that actually leads into the very next question.
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USC: how do colleges approach cell phone use in classes and in general as opposed to K. Through 12. And maybe not. Just how do colleges. But how should
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USC: any ideas? Yeah. And I’ve had real life experiences being a professor here. So I think in terms of
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USC: that.
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USC: you know, if it interferes. And this has happened with me personally, then I basically make it known that it’s interfering in the moment again. No shaming, but more of like, let’s look at what’s happening right now, let’s look at the distractions.
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USC: or how this can be disrespectful to our community and those around us. So I think if it’s something where and I’ve had individuals that may have a crisis or something come up, but they communicate and ask to step away. So I think it depends on. If it is having a negative reaction in the classroom, then I think we need to bring it in and talk about that.
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USC: That’s really interesting, I’m thinking. Back
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USC: early on in my teaching career I remember going to the then director of the of the School of Journalism and asking for some advice, because I had students who were clearly on their laptop
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USC: and not paying attention to the class, and I didn’t know how to deal with this, because I found it distracting. I would lose track. I would lose my own focus because I knew they weren’t paying attention. And the advice I got. And this was a long time ago, was, well.
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USC: they’re digital natives, they can multitask. Just let it go. And so we did let it go. And now we learn that that’s not the correct answer at all.
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USC: and
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USC: I find it hard. And even in our own class, I’m thinking of one instance. I don’t know if you guys remember it, where there was one student who was clearly distracted, and I pointed out that they were distracted, and they got really mad at me, and I actually think that they probably are still mad at me over that. So it’s a really good point it has to be without shaming. I think I probably should have taken a break then.
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USC: and perhaps pulled the student aside and had a little chat instead of trying to address it and keep barreling on as I was. Well, it’s interesting. You said that my personal experience was multiple. People were, and actually the person thanked me afterward.
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USC: So I had a different. But it could have been individual versus multiple people at once on their phones.
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USC: Well, I had one time before before smartphones when we were on our.
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USC: We weren’t using laptops. And we were using lab computers. And I was in front of the classroom lecturing. And one of the students was in the back on her computer. And all of a sudden she goes. Yes, because she was watching the World series. And well, her team had just scored had just scored. One thing I wanted to mention before we wrap up.
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USC: you were talking about the challenges of parenting and the challenges of helicopter parenting. You guys brought up Covid, which you know
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USC: in the book. They talk about the period of of
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USC: 2010 to 2020, and then, of course, 2020 Covid comes so so as if things weren’t bad enough already. Now we have to deal with this. So you’ve already been through something no one else has been through. Now we’re putting you through something else. And yet.
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USC: if you’re raising children during Covid, of course you’re going to helicopter them because the world is falling apart around you. So it’s completely understandable. It just sounds like self-awareness is the key to all of this. It’s key to identifying that. It’s an issue and regulating yourself. It’s key to finding support. It’s turning to professionals for help when you realize it’s time.
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USC: I guess the the scary thing and the question.
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USC: I don’t know how we answer is.
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USC: how do you help people realize that self-awareness is important? Because.
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USC: you know, one of the terrible statistics in the book is that the rate of adolescent suicide, you know, went up 120% over the period of 2010 to 2020. And clearly those
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USC: individuals didn’t identify that they needed help.
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USC: How do? How do you do that? I don’t know that there’s an answer.
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USC: Well, I think the author he brought up the defense, mode, threat, mode versus discovery. And I think those are 2 things. And I talk a lot about that about kind of challenge thinking versus threat thinking. So if we’re thinking that everything is a threat more often than not, then I think we need to look at that right? So so I think that I thought that was very helpful in terms of where it’s a discovery mode where I’m exploring. I’m curious. I’m flexible
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USC: versus everything’s a threat, because that over parenting style, and that helicoptering is all about everything I see as a parent as a threat.
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USC: Melanie, did you have some thoughts? Yeah, I think that’s an interesting mindset to have. I feel like, especially in our society today, there’s and especially in the digital realm, there’s such a negative and
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USC: threat inducing, I guess.
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USC: atmosphere like with the presence of cancel culture and just negative
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USC: cyberbullying that kind of thing on all these social media platforms. You can hide behind a screen and
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USC: say the worst thing you’ve ever said to someone, and you’ve never even met this person. And I feel like when you have that
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USC: approach or perspective when you come into all these things it’s hard not to
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USC: feel like everything is a threat, because you’re just wrapped up in the negativity.
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USC: But I think that mindset of changing it to this is a challenge. This isn’t a threat is really important, especially growing up surrounded by that negativity. Because if that’s what you learn in all these formative years, then it’s going to be hard to kind of get out of that headspace.
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USC: That’s really good.
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USC: I want to wrap up here.
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USC: The author also mentions 6.
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USC: He calls them spiritual practices to improve your own and your kids mental health, and he uses the word spiritual in a non-religious way. So if religion is your approach to spirituality, then of course, that works. But it doesn’t have to, and you can be spiritual without being religious as Bien Lou. His thoughts are shared sacredness, and that is participating in groups with moral.
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USC: charitable, or spiritual purpose, which isn’t just a church. But it could be a fundraiser. It could be. An Aids walk. It could be anything like that. It could be your your own organization, the happy hour
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USC: embodiment any physical ritual, eating together sports, praying together.
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USC: Stillness, which I think is just a great idea. I mean, how often do we actually get get silence?
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USC: I did something very funny. An hour ago, before this event started, I turned my phone off.
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USC: and I can’t remember the last time I did that, except to reset it. So I need to get in that habit, self transcendence, which is sacrificing for a cause larger than your own.
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USC: less judgment, more forgiveness
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USC: and finding awe in nature which seems out of left field but
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USC: very cool.
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USC: So any last thoughts, Danielle or Brianna, any last thoughts to share
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USC: you mentioned stillness as one of the kind of spiritual practices. And you know, just thinking about all the teachers that I spoke with. One thing that’s really helped me. That I have a high school teacher to credit is at the beginning of my High School English class. We would meditate for like 3 to 5 min, and we use the app called headspace. This is not a headspace ad, but
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USC: but so I picked up that habit, and doing that in the mornings is something that’s been really helpful for me. So I definitely do feel that stillness is a good practice
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USC: for me.
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USC: I I do wake up. I do check my phone, but I go to the gym in the morning almost every morning, and that is my meditation, and that is the only way I can get my day started, and if I don’t.
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USC: my day goes not so good as as if I were to go to the gym in the morning. So that’s just me.
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USC: Melanie. Any thoughts either on that topic or just anything in general on this subject. Yeah, I think it’s important to have those kind of safe spaces or safe mindsets. I like to go on a lot of walks, and I think that touches on finding awe in nature.
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USC: I mean, even if it’s in a not so
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USC: picturesque place, I think it’s important to get outside and breathe the fresh air, because
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USC: I mean, unfortunately, I don’t walk as much as I’d like to. It’s kind of like when everything feels a little too much. I do think
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USC: I’ve seen a significant improvement in my mood and my mental health.
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USC: But I think, yeah, I think having a structure, you know, balanced lifestyle is really helpful to kind of
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USC: stepping away from technology, because sometimes it can feel so overwhelming that it’s like
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USC: it’s a whole nother world out there, you know. You kind of have to make a distinction between. This is my real life. This is a digital realm that I can. I have the ability to step away from. And I have the power to do that. So
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USC: and that it’s the power I mean. You can turn it off. You can put it away.
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USC: That’s good, Kelly. Any last thoughts.
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USC: I think, hearing all 3 of them reminds me of something that I do. I speak about a lot of, and I just made this up in my 19 years here, and seeing things are the 3 P’s of like prioritizing mental health, having a plan of action and then practicing it, that all of this is about practicing. So I always say, you know, I’ve you know, been a psychologist for a long time, love, you know.
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USC: immersing myself in the research. But I have to practice this every day and some days I’m good, and some days I’m not. And it’s just every day it’s taking that resilient mindset of what can I do differently? And taking that learning stance rather than being self-critical and beating myself up
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USC: and self-empowering.
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USC: Great. Thank you. Thank you guys very much. If there’s any questions that we haven’t gotten to. We’ll collect them, and we’re going to put together a little sub panel like this, and we’ll go ahead and record the responses to the questions we may not have gotten to, and those of you who registered will email you when that will be available. If you have any other questions. In the meantime you can send them through to us and
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USC: thank you all for being here. Thank you, guys on Zoom, and thanks to our panel.
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USC: everybody have a good day.